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| Homer80 |
 Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 9:34 pm |
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Joined: 15 Jun 2004
Posts: 1386
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slyde wrote: Homer80 wrote: keep in mind that plants don't have ANY essential amino acids ( peanuts and soy included). So all you Vegans will infact suffer from premature aging. Sorry but someone had to let you know.
You're getting any and all confused.
Unlike animal proteins, plant proteins may not contain all the essential amino acids in the necessary proportions. However, a varied vegetarian diet means a mixture of proteins are consumed, the amino acids in one protein compensating for the deficiencies of another. By combining legumes with grains you can acquire all the essential amino acids. Beans and rice, supply all essential amino acids. The peanut butter and whole grain bread in a P & J sandwich supplies all the essential amino acids as well.
Personally, I'm not a vegan. I eat eggs, cheese, yogurt etc. etc.
Ummm no. plant proteins contain no essentail amino acids no matter how you mix them. Even peanuts while high in protein still only rate an extremly low quality protein. But for the record your diet sounds much better than mine. Milk and egg are the highest quality protein. |
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| slyde |
| Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 9:44 pm |
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Joined: 19 Jan 2004
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Homer80 wrote:
Ummm no. plant proteins contain no essentail amino acids no matter how you mix them. Even peanuts while high in protein still only rate an extremly low quality protein. But for the record your diet sounds much better than mine. Milk and egg are the highest quality protein.
I'm not sure where you got that bit of info but, rice is strong in tryptophan, methionine, and valine, and weak in isoleucine and lysine. But rice protein sufficient to provide 100% of our quantitive protein needs, also provides 265% of the adult male requirement for lysine and 266% of that for isoleucine. (It provides 400% or more of all of the others.)
Excessive protein consumption is now strongly linked to bone weakness and osteoporosis. Studies done on calcium loss have shown that as protein consumption increases, so does calcium loss. Not only that, the protein in meat (which is higher in the sulphur-containing amino acids) causes a GREATER calcium loss than the same quantity of protein in soya beans ! So for preventing calcium loss and the possibility of osteoporosis, plant protein is superior to animal protein.
http://www.soyohio.org/health/diet/nutrient.cfm |
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| vaskateboards |
| Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 9:57 pm |
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ORDER OF THE SKULL
Joined: 23 Aug 2004
Posts: 8333
Location: DC
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fuggin hell, after I read AC's post I gave up!!! I knew that everybody will fuckin wright everything down.
I Hate:
Liver, Cornet Beef, Caviar, Oysters, Cow toung, Goat cheese,
brains, hearts, dog, cat and stuff like that
I love: pussy, pineapple, mousse o'chocolat, sushi and hell of a lot more |
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| Homer80 |
| Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 10:05 pm |
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| skategreaser |
| Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 10:07 pm |
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Joined: 25 Apr 2002
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Location: OxCx
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| I cannot eat capers, lima beans or peas. Everything else, I pretty much down for. |
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| slyde |
| Posted: Tue Feb 22, 2005 10:10 pm |
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Joined: 19 Jan 2004
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Two of the essential amino acids, lysine and tryptophan, are poorly represented in most plant proteins. Thus strict vegetarians should ensure that their diet contains sufficient amounts of these two amino acids.
That is a quote from your first site. Two are poorly represented. NOT ALL. And it said POORLY represented not NOT represented. Anyway, I'm done with this argument. I'm gonna go eat.
Edit: Okay one more quote. This comes from your ask the dietition link:
"In regards to incomplete proteins, you are misinformed. If a person daily eats a variety of legumes (beans, peas, nuts), seeds, fruits, vegetables and grains, they will get all the amino acids an adult needs in sufficient quantity to supply all 8 essential amino acids. According to Dr. Peter Pellett at the University of Massachusetts at Amherst, the limiting amino acid is lysine, which would be a concern in persons eating only grains. I would suggest you read the vegetarian topic."
Okay, now I'm really done.
Nice to meet you btw. |
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| Homer80 |
| Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2005 8:25 am |
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Joined: 15 Jun 2004
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Since we are mammals, all mammalian proteins tend to have the same set of AAs as our own. Plant proteins may be deficient in lysine, threonine, and tryptophan. In the animal kingdom, peptides and proteins regulate metabolism and provide structural support. The cells and the organs of our body are controlled by peptide hormones . Insufficient protein in the diet may prevent the body from producing adequate levels of peptide hormones and structural proteins to sustain normal bodily functions. Deficiency of good quality protein in the diet may contribute to seemingly unrelated symptoms such as sexual dysfunction, blood pressure problems, fatigue, obesity, diabetes, frequent infections, digestive problems, and bone mass loss leading to osteoporosis. Egg white protein is considered to have one of the best amino acids profiles for human nutrition. Plant proteins generally have lower content of some essential amino acids such as lysine and methionine. Soy protein is one of the best plant proteins, but nevertheless, the most prominent difference in this is the proportion of the essential sulfur-containing amino acid methionine. Egg protein has approximately three times more methionine than is found in soy protein.
You can find plenty of agruments that support the elimination of animal protein but they are weak at best. In todays day and age it's not politicly correct to talk about meat over vegtables but the facts are the facts. We need vegtables for vitamins and minerals but our bodies have become dependent on animal proteins.
Also keep in mind that I dont practice what I preach in this case. I'm only playing the Devils advocate and stateing a case for the quality of meat protein and why it's important.As far as this argument goes win or lose I lose in the end. |
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| SantaCruzSkater |
| Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2005 10:47 am |
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Cows are mammals 
I just wanted to give you a hard time
I am not a vegetarian  |
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| slyde |
| Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2005 12:20 pm |
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Joined: 19 Jan 2004
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I wasn't trying to argue whether being a vegetarian was good or not. I was just trying to let you know that your statement that plants do not contain ANY of the essential amino acids is incorrect.
But, as you seem to want to keep going I'll say this. I hear all kinds of arguments AGAINST vegetarianism by people all the time. Personally, I don't eat meat. Why? Because I don't need to, I don't want to and I don't have to. Am I an animal rights activist. Not really at this point. After all, as I said, I cook meat for people every day. I'm a chef and its not a vegetarian restaurant, although I'd love to switch to one.
Who cares if "mammalian protiens tend to have the same set of AAs as our own?" Ever see a cow eat a slice of glazed ham?
I don't get what is so weak about the argument for a meat free diet?
1. It saves water
2. It saves land
3. Its economical for the individual.
4. Its safer than meat (not so many worries about salmonella etc.) 97% of all deadly food poisoning cases are caused by meat.
5. Its more humane.
6. A study in England showed that the vegetarians they studied were healthier than the meat eaters.
7. Vegetarians tend to live seven years longer than meat eaters.
8. Vegetarians weigh, on average, 12 pounds less than meat eaters. In our fat society that's a big deal.
That's a few reasons. You seem worried about protien. Its really not that hard to get enough protien. I promise.
Leonardo Da Vinci: One day the world will look upon the eating of animals as it now looks upon the eating of humans.
Anyway, I'm going to work.
See ya.
-Slyde |
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| Homer80 |
| Posted: Wed Feb 23, 2005 1:10 pm |
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Joined: 15 Jun 2004
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Quote: I wasn't trying to argue whether being a vegetarian was good or not. I was just trying to let you know that your statement that plants do not contain ANY of the essential amino acids is incorrect.
Yes you are correct.
But I am enjoying the conversation.( argument/debate)
Quote:
1. It saves water
2. It saves land
I dont really know the facts to debate this
Quote: 3. Its economical for the individual.
Not really, If a person daily eats a variety of legumes (beans, peas, nuts), seeds, fruits, vegetables and grains. that will run up the dollars at the grocery store.
Quote: 4. Its safer than meat (not so many worries about salmonella etc.) 97% of all deadly food poisoning cases are caused by meat.
First off , pesticides, ment to kill insects that are able to survive radioactive fall out. As far as food poisoning goes I do beleive Chi,Chi's last food poisening out break was due to bad onions http://www.about-hepatitis.com/articles/chichis/chichis34.htm
I'll take my chances with salmonella you can get the hepatitis.
Quote: 5. Its more humane.
Yes, you gotta kill it if your gonna grille it.!
Quote: 6. A study in England showed that the vegetarians they studied were healthier than the meat eaters.
7. Vegetarians tend to live seven years longer than meat eaters.
If I lived in England I would be a vegetarian too. I have to give you that one I wont mess with Mad Cow disease.
Quote: 8. Vegetarians weigh, on average, 12 pounds less than meat eaters. In our fat society that's a big deal.
Keep in mind that muscle weighs more than fat. So I would have to agree here also but not as support to your statement but in fact mine. And yes our society is overweight and more people should adopt your eating habits ( maybe include a little fish in there as well)
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